Tuesday, January 4, 2011

Kip Litton Story - Backup Pg 6 of 8

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Die Optional
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 2:35PM - in reply to dhdhdhhdhReply | Return to Index | Report Post
Yes, I believe he would neglect all of those responsibilities to go fly around the country. My dad was a pooper as well and dentist, had 4 kids and many mistresses.

Makes perfect sense.
fjfgdffj
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 2:38PM - in reply to Study of K.Litton RunningReply | Return to Index | Report Post

Study of K.Litton Running wrote:

Do you think Kip Litton's wife (an attorney) is going to threaten to sue us?

No, but I bet she had something to do with the original thread being killed.
Study of K.Litton Running
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 2:40PM - in reply to road rashedReply | Return to Index | Report Post

road rashed wrote:

good luck as it is obvious to most that he hasn't only cheated in races, but that he has committed charity fraud. Going to be hard to find a lawyer to get behind a weird case like that where there is a myriad of evidence against him.


Does anyone have any evidence of the alleged charity fraud side of things? Basically he's won some prize money for being a top masters in races he's more likely than not cheated in. And basically he had a website, worldrecordrun.com, which was supposedly collecting money for CF but was going directly to the website. I learned about Kip for the 1st time after worldrecordrun.com had already been shut down. So I wish I knew more on what that website looked like before it was shut down. Thanks.
Jefe in the CO
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 2:42PM - in reply to TrackCoachReply | Return to Index | Report Post
And so...the takeaway is...what exactly? That Kip can't jump?

After reading this and the original thread (anyone know why it got deleted?) I would probably put more credence in Kip's ability to jump a girl-sized sports car than his ability to run a Full Mary.

I would think that it would be pretty simple to cut most courses. All Kip would have to do is hide his number, wear an inconspicuous shirt/shorts, start out running, hop into a porto potty along the course, wait for several minutes, change and VoilĂ ! Now it’s off to find some more porto potties on the back end of the course, change back and come charging down the homestretch like a rhino.

Now that I say it out loud it does sound kind of fun. It has all the elements of a classic story; intrigue, suspense, humor, risk, villains and, best of all, LRC infamy.
Mr Oblivious
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 2:42PM - in reply to Study of K.Litton RunningReply | Return to Index | Report Post
Haven't read this whole thread so don't know if this has been linked.

http://races2run.blogspot.com/2010/08/world-record-runkip-litton.html
Study of K.Litton Running
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:00PM - in reply to Mr ObliviousReply | Return to Index | Report Post

Mr Oblivious wrote:

Haven't read this whole thread so don't know if this has been linked.

http://races2run.blogspot.com/2010/08/world-record-runkip-litton.html


Yeah, that's the Delaware staff posting that. d-Tag off the shoe, DQ at Delaware...

website archives dont seem to have www.worldrecordrun.com
GK
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:07PM - in reply to Orange marker turn around coneReply | Return to Index | Report Post
I didn't make much attempt to conceal my identity. This is it for me posting. You can argue back and forth if you think he cheated or not, but I know. I'd be happy to reply more via email.
I've probably run more of the same races as this guy than anyone else. Just in 2010 - Arizona, Gasparilla, Shamrock, St. Louis, Delaware, and Missoula. Three of the splits put him behind me at the half, but ahead at the finish. Anyone that runs under 3 hours can tell you that even in a bigger race (say 2000-4000 runners) it gets very lonely that second half. If you get caught, you know. Not only that, but you can typically recall how many people passed you, and you can easily identify them. You particularly remember the people you don't expect to pass you. He doesn't look at all familiar. I'm dead certain he didn't pass me in Gasparilla or Missoula. St. Louis is a blur for me, but he is missing two splits, so I doubt anybody saw him. I would have never seen him in the others as I was either ahead or behind him the whole race.
nerp
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:12PM - in reply to long soxReply | Return to Index | Report Post

long sox wrote:

[quote]roger that charlie wrote:

Kip litton race photos for Rochester marathon look a little fishy. Early on he's'breathing hard behind a walker fatter lady. Then He looks like he's'grabbing his hamstring in bit of pain at the finish.

So kip won 300dollars for being 1st master at rochester?



Photos for Kip here:
http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=61901&PWD=&BIB=302
Photos for second masters:
http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=61901&PWD=&BIB=314

If we ignore the generic start and finish line photos that aren't of any particular runner, the second masters guy gets twice as many photos as Kip, including some shots from rural/forest parts of the course where Kip has no photos at all.

I wonder if Mr Maki remembers another masters guy passing him, because it can't have been at the start, since Kip started more than 30 seconds later.[/quote]

No smoking gun, but a little more info on this one. I don't believe there were any intermediate splits taken at this race, so no luck there.

There are two sets of pictures. One is at the finish line, the other is at the turn near the Ford St. Bridge, just after 24.5 miles. On the course map http://www.mapmyrun.com/routes/view/22857522 , the bridge is the little dogleg just before 25 miles. The map isn't 100% right- they actually run under the bridge and then circle back around the walkway to go over it. This is a guy that finished in the top 20, no pictures of him until 1.75 miles to go(measured on mapmyrun, using all tangents).

The lady you seem him passing was in the Half Marathon. She ran 2:54, ~13:15/mile, so he passed her at ~2:31 into her race. His race started 3-4 minutes late, so at the point of the pass, he was at about 2:42-2:43 on the clock. From that point to the finish, he was averaging somewhere in the neighborhood of an 8:30 mile. Best case scenario, he was running 7:45. Perhaps this is where the hamstring comes into play?

I realize that is is an extremely rough calculation- I may be able to get the actual start time of each race to refine the image further. In either case, he would have been ahead of Mr. Maki in the closing miles.
good times
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:20PM - in reply to nerpReply | Return to Index | Report Post
Any pictures of Kip on the trail? Looks like a pretty easy spot to catch him running. And presuming he's absent from that part of the race, does it coincide with a place where he could cut the course?
Really???
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:27PM - in reply to nerpReply | Return to Index | Report Post
No smoking gun, but a little more info on this one. I don't believe there were any intermediate splits taken at this race, so no luck there.

There are two sets of pictures. One is at the finish line, the other is at the turn near the Ford St. Bridge, just after 24.5 miles. On the course map http://www.mapmyrun.com/routes/view/22857522 , the bridge is the little dogleg just before 25 miles. The map isn't 100% right- they actually run under the bridge and then circle back around the walkway to go over it. This is a guy that finished in the top 20, no pictures of him until 1.75 miles to go(measured on mapmyrun, using all tangents).

The lady you seem him passing was in the Half Marathon. She ran 2:54, ~13:15/mile, so he passed her at ~2:31 into her race. His race started 3-4 minutes late, so at the point of the pass, he was at about 2:42-2:43 on the clock. From that point to the finish, he was averaging somewhere in the neighborhood of an 8:30 mile. Best case scenario, he was running 7:45. Perhaps this is where the hamstring comes into play?

I realize that is is an extremely rough calculation- I may be able to get the actual start time of each race to refine the image further. In either case, he would have been ahead of Mr. Maki in the closing miles.


nerp wrote:

[quote]long sox wrote:

[quote]roger that charlie wrote:

Kip litton race photos for Rochester marathon look a little fishy. Early on he's'breathing hard behind a walker fatter lady. Then He looks like he's'grabbing his hamstring in bit of pain at the finish.

So kip won 300dollars for being 1st master at rochester?



Photos for Kip here:
http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=61901&PWD=&BIB=302
Photos for second masters:
http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=61901&PWD=&BIB=314

If we ignore the generic start and finish line photos that aren't of any particular runner, the second masters guy gets twice as many photos as Kip, including some shots from rural/forest parts of the course where Kip has no photos at all.

I wonder if Mr Maki remembers another masters guy passing him, because it can't have been at the start, since Kip started more than 30 seconds later.[/quote]

No smoking gun, but a little more info on this one. I don't believe there were any intermediate splits taken at this race, so no luck there.

There are two sets of pictures. One is at the finish line, the other is at the turn near the Ford St. Bridge, just after 24.5 miles. On the course map http://www.mapmyrun.com/routes/view/22857522 , the bridge is the little dogleg just before 25 miles. The map isn't 100% right- they actually run under the bridge and then circle back around the walkway to go over it. This is a guy that finished in the top 20, no pictures of him until 1.75 miles to go(measured on mapmyrun, using all tangents).

The lady you seem him passing was in the Half Marathon. She ran 2:54, ~13:15/mile, so he passed her at ~2:31 into her race. His race started 3-4 minutes late, so at the point of the pass, he was at about 2:42-2:43 on the clock. From that point to the finish, he was averaging somewhere in the neighborhood of an 8:30 mile. Best case scenario, he was running 7:45. Perhaps this is where the hamstring comes into play?

I realize that is is an extremely rough calculation- I may be able to get the actual start time of each race to refine the image further. In either case, he would have been ahead of Mr. Maki in the closing miles.[/quote]
___________________________________________________________
Look at the way he runs...and look at the way the 2nd place master runs....That should be enough evidence right there to completely end this argument....
nyloco
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:36PM - in reply to nerpReply | Return to Index | Report Post
I sent the second place runner (Eric Maki) an e-mail asking him if he recalled anything. Eric consistently runs under 3 hours and usually has good recollections of his races.
Study of K.Litton Running
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:40PM - in reply to nylocoReply | Return to Index | Report Post

nyloco wrote:

I sent the second place runner (Eric Maki) an e-mail asking him if he recalled anything. Eric consistently runs under 3 hours and usually has good recollections of his races.


Nice job.
dhdhdhhdh
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:55PM - in reply to fjfgdffjReply | Return to Index | Report Post

fjfgdffj wrote:

[quote]Study of K.Litton Running wrote:

Do you think Kip Litton's wife (an attorney) is going to threaten to sue us?

No, but I bet she had something to do with the original thread being killed.[/quote]

Actually, if I had to guess, I'd say her involvement in killing the original thread would be limited to something like Kip "borrowing" her stationary without her knowledge, or using her name/title to threaten LetsRun. Pure speculation, but I doubt she knows he's cheating. If he made her aware of the original LetsRun thread... and she's intelligent enough to be a lawyer, she'd know he was full of sh*t once she read through it.
nerp
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 3:56PM - in reply to Really???Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Reviewing the brightroom photos, there is absolutely no way Kip Litton did the entire course. There is a series of photos taken somewhere between miles 13 and 15 that show the Marathon leaders from the overall winner all the way through the top 30 runners.

Unless he came from way behind (he would have had to bee behind the 3rd place female at the half), he never completed the section along the Erie Canal path.
Chyeah man
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 4:04PM - in reply to nerpReply | Return to Index | Report Post

nerp wrote:
Unless he came from way behind (he would have had to bee behind the 3rd place female at the half), he never completed the section along the Erie Canal path.


Can you contact these finishers even via facebook or something and ask if they remember seeing him?
unclaimed photos
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 4:09PM - in reply to nerpReply | Return to Index | Report Post
Anybody look for unclaimed photos in these races to see if he is not being identified by some photographers because he is covering the bib number with the alternate shirt?
Keith Stone
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 4:19PM - in reply to good timesReply | Return to Index | Report Post
At least he doesn't look like this gal, his predecessor:

http://www.asiorders.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=1500&BIB=4705

Chandra also did multiple races (no where near Kip's count) and claimed both to be attempting to raise awareness for 9/11 and trying to get an Olympic Trials qualifier, both of which needed funding. She also threatened to both sue me and others, as well as have the FBI investigate us for the "crime" of internet libel. An empty but annoying threat, but proof that some of these sociopaths start to believe some of their own press.

I saw several references to him covering up his bib number. That may be an effort to short circuit the "no pictures on the course" argument.

He could be a latently talented runner with horrible pacing skills. He could be a relatively talented cheat. With his web site down it makes no sense that he continues to race since I assume that's how he was getting his money. Neither of the Facebook pages (his personal, or World Record Run) seem to be mentioning his races or soliciting funds.

I find it odd that none of the archives seem to have any record of www.worldrecordrun.com. It could be there's some active sanitizing going on. If you ran a marathon you'd think you'd mention that on your FB page no matter what your time was.

Considering he claims to have run 50 miles a week all year, plus biked another 65, he would certainly have some conditioning. I know plenty of guys that can break 3 hours off 50 MPH average. Just a lot of things don't seem to make sense.
broken coccyx
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 4:20PM - in reply to Really???Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
just look at the guy in the photos! Bandana, low-slung hat, big dark sunglasses always. If that's not a guy trying to run in disguise, I don't know what is.

Combine that with his many races "run" in excessive clothing--pants, jackets, hand held shirts, covered bibs. It's just so obvious.

Combine the clothes with his body--again, LOOK at the guy! No chunky 49 year old guy runs 17 min 5ks, 250 marathons, etc.

This is really more sad than anything. It's pathetic. Some overweight dentist flying all over the country to cheat at marathons. Imagine him flying home, alone, staring at the back of the seat in front of him, replaying in his head the thrill of "beating" all those people in the last few miles.
erasahead
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 4:21PM - in reply to Study of K.Litton RunningReply | Return to Index | Report Post
Is he wearing a Garmin?
Chyeah man
RE: Kip Litton 17:17 5K Finishing Picture at BAA 2010 5K. 4:04 went by before he crossed starting line. 1/4/2011 4:23PM - in reply to broken coccyxReply | Return to Index | Report Post
a 17:17 5K with a baggy light blue windbreaker jacket on. also at 5:34 pace to be running roughly the same pace as 6:48 pace finishers
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